10/28/2002 Minutes - Laserfiche WebLink

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L chief officially retired as of October 11th. Mrs. Ramsey asked if the board wants the Civil Service Handbook on the reference list. Mr. Thomay indicated it should be, along with the Rules and Regulations Manual, and the union contract. Mrs. Ramsey asked about medical protocol. Mr. Thomay indicated we do require paramedic certification for the fire department but he doesn't believe it is necessary to test that for the chief. Mrs. Ramsey asked how many people are in the department. Mr. Jesse replied 45-50. She asked for feedback on using books that are not about fire fighting. She referred to leadership books listed on the reference sheet. Mr. Thomay said there should be something of that nature used. He asked about the Fire Chiefs Handbook. Mrs. Ramsey said that book is more "nuts and bolts" and the department should already have it. She asked if the board knows what books the department has already. Mrs. Rote indicated she would have to meet with the chiefs secretary to find out what books are in the houses. She cannot go to the acting chief and ask him since he intends to take the test. Mr. Thomay said they can make a motion for the dates but the question is do they need a motion for the reference material. Mrs. Rote replied it is up to the appointing authority to pick the books and do the posting. Mrs. Giesser said her recollection is they have to make a motion on the percents they want for the written and the assessment, the dates of the exams, and the percentage for passing. Mr. Thomay asked for a recommendation on a passing percentage on the written exam. Mrs. Ramsey replied it should be 70%. She said whenever they do a test they do something called an item analysis and it tells them the difficulty level of the questions. They have an idea when they build the test if it is difficult or not. Again, you want more difficulty with an exam if you have more candidates. They want candidates to know the material but they don't want to make a test ridiculously hard. There was further discussion about the grading system and establishing a passing score. Mrs. Ramsey said they can do something called a flexible passing point where you can set something equal to 70 but generally for police and fire promotional tests, you go by state law which says something to the effect of establish a 70%, but not an actual 70%. You could make a curve, a flexible passing point. She would prefer to stick with 70%. She said overall they want a passing grade of 70%. She said some cities do it differently and say you have to pass the written to go on to the assessment. She said because of our time frame, we can't do that. The overall grade, written and assessment combined, will have to be 70%. She said typically a candidate passes and then gets extra points. Mr. Dubelko said he believes the commission would like to hear her recommendations for the reference materials. Mrs. Ramsey asked if Mr. Jesse would like to have some input here. Mr. Jesse indicated it would be better to hold off talking about it right now so they can keep the confidentially in tact prior to the release of the notice. They discussed more dates. Mrs. Rote said the written test must be December 12th or after because of the ten day issue. She said the list cannot be posted until the books are in place. Mrs. Ramsey asked if they could give the assessment first. Mr. Jesse asked if there is any advantage to doing the oral portion first. Mrs. Ramsey indicated she was trying to help us out with dates and the books. Mr. Jesse said if we find out about the books tomorrow then we should be all right. Mrs. Ramsey said if the list is ready tomorrow and we have the books by the first of November, it may work. Mr. Jesse said we are ok. He said as long as we have the books by November 9t'. Mrs. Giesser asked for clarification on the time frame. Mrs. Rote confirmed the candidates must have 30 days prior to the written test to study. The ten days is the time frame we have to receive the list that will be posted so that we have time to get the books and have them in place. Mrs. Ramsey asked if someone signs the books out since there are only 2 sets. The worse thing a candidate says after a test is that he/she did not have enough time to study. Mrs. Rote indicated the books have to stay in house. Mr. Jesse said the availability issue is covered. Mrs. Giesser pointed out they are providing a list of where the books can be obtained so if a candidate wants to take that initiative, they may do so. Mrs. Rote said they have to make sure the assessors do not know any of the candidates. She asked when Mrs. Ramsey would have the pictures available. She mentioned that with the last test, they went through 6 chiefs before hitting on people they didn't know. Mrs. Ramsey said they could bring in pictures during the pre-test orientation. If a candidate does not go to the pre-test, she could give the board the pictures or e-mail them so they can be posted. Mr. Jesse asked how many people she has in the chiefs' pool. Mrs. Ramsey said maybe a dozen. Mr. Jesse suggested getting all the photos. He indicated they need 5